Barry
I really do resent the implication that I am against timeshare because I WAS a travel agent, what a load of twaddle !!!!..
I am neither for or against timeshare, what I am against is the way in which people are drawn into these schemes without being told the whole story of exactly what they are paying for and I spend alot of time trying to help people who are desperate to get out of these deals.I will not get into any personal argument with you about how your company is turning the tide. I am not here for that.Put your point over properly without trying to insinuate that the moderators, the site, the " Fred" the world of travel agents are all there to undermine your cause.
No-one is plotting scheming,behind the scenes to put you down,but you do have to take in other peoples GENUINE mistrust of these companies.
Jan
GVC Sunterra - Is it a freebie?
by bazrat on Wed May 07, 2008 21:50 pm
Everybody is entitled to there point of view,but if that view is going to be used by others to make important decisions than that information cannot be tainted.
At no point on no post on any site that i have posted on have i recommended anybody to join any timeshare scheme what i have given is the facts,what i have not done is used my own personal preferences to persuade anybody to join or not it is there choice and there's alone.
Can anybody on this site say the same.
Barry
At no point on no post on any site that i have posted on have i recommended anybody to join any timeshare scheme what i have given is the facts,what i have not done is used my own personal preferences to persuade anybody to join or not it is there choice and there's alone.
Can anybody on this site say the same.
Barry
-
bazrat - Posts: 0
- Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 21:47 pm
by bazrat on Wed May 07, 2008 22:01 pm
Jan just some of your views.
"Hi Chrissy
Have you not read the thread about this company ?. Really would you want to drag a friend into it as well ???...
Considering all the facts I think the �100 is also pie in the sky.
I just burst out laughing when I read this,, all the people who have been scammed are at their wits end trying to get out of it, then someone comes and asks if they recommend a " Friend" do they get money...??? ( wasn't laughing it was more hysterical )"
by the way Jan they do give you money or gifts for recommending people even if they don't sign up.
Is this informed comment.
"Chrissy so long as you know all of the facts about the company involved, I still would not recommend any friends,these people are experts at parting you from your hard earned cash.There is NO such thing as a FREE holiday,that is something I have learned from years of experience being a moderator on this site.
Dont say you havent been warned.
Jan"
Jan you have the advantage in the position you hold to give informed advice,i take it you stand by all your comments.
Barry
"Hi Chrissy
Have you not read the thread about this company ?. Really would you want to drag a friend into it as well ???...
Considering all the facts I think the �100 is also pie in the sky.
I just burst out laughing when I read this,, all the people who have been scammed are at their wits end trying to get out of it, then someone comes and asks if they recommend a " Friend" do they get money...??? ( wasn't laughing it was more hysterical )"
by the way Jan they do give you money or gifts for recommending people even if they don't sign up.
Is this informed comment.
"Chrissy so long as you know all of the facts about the company involved, I still would not recommend any friends,these people are experts at parting you from your hard earned cash.There is NO such thing as a FREE holiday,that is something I have learned from years of experience being a moderator on this site.
Dont say you havent been warned.
Jan"
Jan you have the advantage in the position you hold to give informed advice,i take it you stand by all your comments.
Barry
-
bazrat - Posts: 0
- Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 21:47 pm
by doggy50k on Wed May 07, 2008 22:26 pm
Hi
I thought I'd join in at this stage.
As a Moderator on timesharetalk I can easily say that we have and continue to point people towards reports on holiday watchdog about the many many scammers in the timeshare industry. A simple search of the site will confirm the number of mentions you get.
Many of these scams now take the form of holiday clubs where no actual property is owned. People are suckered in to these schemes with the promise of cheap holidays by people and companies who have no actual real estate behind them. They are in fact just glorified fly-buys.
We have recently had someone trying to cause trouble on timesharetalk, and I warned them for trolling. The same person posts on here and appears to be doing the same thing. They are actively campaigning against a product and company of which they have no direct contact, membership or dealings of any sort.
I know they have had a problem with Sunterra's use of LCI and the continuing use of them by DRI.
DRI have taken steps to move away from the use of such companies.
It is my understanding that Barry posted some information frm DRI in relation to this and it was removed.
Could someone please explain why this took place?
Is holidaywatchdog still championing the truth, or has their acquisition by TripAdvisor played a part in the reluctance to pass on official information about companies like DRI from happy members like Barry? Is Trip Advisor not actually influenced by any commisions they may get from their "official partners" for bookings made through them?
http://www.travelmole.com/stories/1126420.php
I thought I'd join in at this stage.
As a Moderator on timesharetalk I can easily say that we have and continue to point people towards reports on holiday watchdog about the many many scammers in the timeshare industry. A simple search of the site will confirm the number of mentions you get.
Many of these scams now take the form of holiday clubs where no actual property is owned. People are suckered in to these schemes with the promise of cheap holidays by people and companies who have no actual real estate behind them. They are in fact just glorified fly-buys.
We have recently had someone trying to cause trouble on timesharetalk, and I warned them for trolling. The same person posts on here and appears to be doing the same thing. They are actively campaigning against a product and company of which they have no direct contact, membership or dealings of any sort.
I know they have had a problem with Sunterra's use of LCI and the continuing use of them by DRI.
DRI have taken steps to move away from the use of such companies.
It is my understanding that Barry posted some information frm DRI in relation to this and it was removed.
Could someone please explain why this took place?
Is holidaywatchdog still championing the truth, or has their acquisition by TripAdvisor played a part in the reluctance to pass on official information about companies like DRI from happy members like Barry? Is Trip Advisor not actually influenced by any commisions they may get from their "official partners" for bookings made through them?
http://www.travelmole.com/stories/1126420.php
-
doggy50k - Posts: 0
- Joined: Wed May 07, 2008 22:07 pm
by Steve2 on Wed May 07, 2008 23:29 pm
I think that there's an error in the cost estimates I presented above (apologies for this) and, as more information is now available on the cost of points, I'm going to re-visit the calculations.
There's an auction of DRI points on ebay at the moment and information there suggests that DRI sell old style points for about �130 each. Also, a couple of auctions have recently completed and old points seem to be available on re-sale for about �30 (I'm assuming that 1 old point=100 new points).
I think that it was agreed that you need about 130 old points to get 2 weeks in a 2 bed apartment in the schools hols. This 130 points at �130 per point costs �16,900. If this �16,900 was put in a building society, it would earn �845 per year (at 5%).
Let's assume that the 130 points are held for 25 years and then re-sold at �30 per point. That's a loss of �13,000 which, spread over 25 years, is �520 per year.
Finally, there are the annual maintenance costs of �880.
So, assuming that you buy all of your 130 points direct from DRI, the annual costs of a 2 bed apartment for 2 weeks in the school hols is �845+�520+�880=�2,245.
On the other hand, suppose that you only buy the minimum 40 points from DRI and the other 90 from a re-seller. The maintenance costs are the same (�880). The cost of the points is now �7,900 (=(40*�130)+(90*�30)) which, at 5%, could earn �395 per annum. Finally, the annual depreciation charge is �160 (=�4,000/25 years). Under these assumptions, the annual cost is �880+�395+�160=�1,435.
These calculations are based on certain assumptions; change these and you will change the estimated annual costs. For example, if you hold the points for only 10 years then the annual costs increase to �3,025 (all points from DRI) and �1,675 (40 points from DRI, 90 from re-seller). Nevertheless, they do illustrate the importance of certain factors (e.g., who you buy your points from and how long points will be owned).
There's an auction of DRI points on ebay at the moment and information there suggests that DRI sell old style points for about �130 each. Also, a couple of auctions have recently completed and old points seem to be available on re-sale for about �30 (I'm assuming that 1 old point=100 new points).
I think that it was agreed that you need about 130 old points to get 2 weeks in a 2 bed apartment in the schools hols. This 130 points at �130 per point costs �16,900. If this �16,900 was put in a building society, it would earn �845 per year (at 5%).
Let's assume that the 130 points are held for 25 years and then re-sold at �30 per point. That's a loss of �13,000 which, spread over 25 years, is �520 per year.
Finally, there are the annual maintenance costs of �880.
So, assuming that you buy all of your 130 points direct from DRI, the annual costs of a 2 bed apartment for 2 weeks in the school hols is �845+�520+�880=�2,245.
On the other hand, suppose that you only buy the minimum 40 points from DRI and the other 90 from a re-seller. The maintenance costs are the same (�880). The cost of the points is now �7,900 (=(40*�130)+(90*�30)) which, at 5%, could earn �395 per annum. Finally, the annual depreciation charge is �160 (=�4,000/25 years). Under these assumptions, the annual cost is �880+�395+�160=�1,435.
These calculations are based on certain assumptions; change these and you will change the estimated annual costs. For example, if you hold the points for only 10 years then the annual costs increase to �3,025 (all points from DRI) and �1,675 (40 points from DRI, 90 from re-seller). Nevertheless, they do illustrate the importance of certain factors (e.g., who you buy your points from and how long points will be owned).
- Steve2
- Posts: 0
- Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2007 03:19 am
by bazrat on Thu May 08, 2008 00:05 am
Hi steve if you take into account all the variables you would need a crane computer to work it out,Joking aside i would base my calculation on 30 years because when you get into your late seventies holiday travel becomes less of a draw.(using my parents as a example)
This is were it gets complicated if you read a previous post of mine the first 10 years 2 holidays peak season.
remaining 10years taken when you feel like 3 holidays a year.
now your retired and you like Tenerife 13000 points gets you 6 weeks there plus a half pointer.
I know it is simplistic to look at it this way but the figures do add up.
Barry
There is currently a debate on what is the average holding in points 16000 plus so far is the bench mark.
This is were it gets complicated if you read a previous post of mine the first 10 years 2 holidays peak season.
remaining 10years taken when you feel like 3 holidays a year.
now your retired and you like Tenerife 13000 points gets you 6 weeks there plus a half pointer.
I know it is simplistic to look at it this way but the figures do add up.
Barry
There is currently a debate on what is the average holding in points 16000 plus so far is the bench mark.
-
bazrat - Posts: 0
- Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 21:47 pm
by Fred 2 on Thu May 08, 2008 00:08 am
I have no direct connection with this site except as a poster of fairly long standing.
This forum � �Timeshare and Holiday Clubs� � is intended as a meeting place where people can seek and be given advice about problems or, if they are fortunate and arrive here early enough, potential problems. I think that the forum does a good job.
It is not intended as a place for protracted discussion of the kind seen recently on various of the threads headed for Sunterra/ DRI nor of the pros and cons of one type of holiday against another. It is about problems.
I believe that the forum has been extremely patient with recent posters who decided to have a public spat about their beliefs. This has nothing to do with the rights or wrongs of either position, just that this has no place whatever on this forum.
In the case of Timesharetalk the position is different. There is a dedicated forum � Shark Alley � which deals with problems in a similar way to this one. The site is however much larger and has space for ongoing discussions about, for example DRI, which has many separate threads which have existed for years � some far more heated than the argument which carried over to this forum. These appear to have had a real influence for the good upon the conduct of Sunterra/ DRI but discussions of that type are not appropriate here.
I do note however that the posters who were arguing here had previously had the same thing going elsewhere. One of them was warned off so the argument could not continue. At about that time the other started to post here, presumably in the fairly secure knowledge that the other would follow and the argument could begin again � which it did. On three threads. It seems therefore that the main purpose of coming here was more to continue the argument than to make fresh points as these had been gone over to the point of tedium elsewhere. Both clearly enjoy a good argument but it is quite clear that however well and accurately either made their point it would not influence the other one bit. The argument had therefore lost its point and, as it attracted very little input from others, was not contributing to this forum to the slightest degree.
I am of the opinion that both posters should now call time on the whole thing, go away and, if they must continue this exercise, do it somewhere else.
I notice comment which suggests that the content of the forum could be influenced by commercial considerations. If I did believe this to be the case I would not post. I have not noticed this on this forum and did not know that the site had been taken over until I was told - by the site itself. I consider that the only things which are likely to be removed are material considered to be copyright, the downright offensive, fake posts designed to mislead and � as with Timesharetalk � things which have been forced upon the site by the unpleasant who can afford expensive solicitors.
It would be better if we could work together I think. There are a lot of rogues out there and, without a doubt, divided we fall.
This forum � �Timeshare and Holiday Clubs� � is intended as a meeting place where people can seek and be given advice about problems or, if they are fortunate and arrive here early enough, potential problems. I think that the forum does a good job.
It is not intended as a place for protracted discussion of the kind seen recently on various of the threads headed for Sunterra/ DRI nor of the pros and cons of one type of holiday against another. It is about problems.
I believe that the forum has been extremely patient with recent posters who decided to have a public spat about their beliefs. This has nothing to do with the rights or wrongs of either position, just that this has no place whatever on this forum.
In the case of Timesharetalk the position is different. There is a dedicated forum � Shark Alley � which deals with problems in a similar way to this one. The site is however much larger and has space for ongoing discussions about, for example DRI, which has many separate threads which have existed for years � some far more heated than the argument which carried over to this forum. These appear to have had a real influence for the good upon the conduct of Sunterra/ DRI but discussions of that type are not appropriate here.
I do note however that the posters who were arguing here had previously had the same thing going elsewhere. One of them was warned off so the argument could not continue. At about that time the other started to post here, presumably in the fairly secure knowledge that the other would follow and the argument could begin again � which it did. On three threads. It seems therefore that the main purpose of coming here was more to continue the argument than to make fresh points as these had been gone over to the point of tedium elsewhere. Both clearly enjoy a good argument but it is quite clear that however well and accurately either made their point it would not influence the other one bit. The argument had therefore lost its point and, as it attracted very little input from others, was not contributing to this forum to the slightest degree.
I am of the opinion that both posters should now call time on the whole thing, go away and, if they must continue this exercise, do it somewhere else.
I notice comment which suggests that the content of the forum could be influenced by commercial considerations. If I did believe this to be the case I would not post. I have not noticed this on this forum and did not know that the site had been taken over until I was told - by the site itself. I consider that the only things which are likely to be removed are material considered to be copyright, the downright offensive, fake posts designed to mislead and � as with Timesharetalk � things which have been forced upon the site by the unpleasant who can afford expensive solicitors.
It would be better if we could work together I think. There are a lot of rogues out there and, without a doubt, divided we fall.
- Fred 2
- Posts: 316
- Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2005 17:13 pm
by bazrat on Thu May 08, 2008 00:36 am
Fred yet again i ask you to get your facts right.
Fact 1 fullmonty/Marjory whatever name they go under posted
unsubstantiated accusations on this site i challenged them.
fact 2 before i came onto this site i never heard or communicated with fullmonty/Marjory so were the argument started before you must show me the proof.
Fact 3 fullmonty/marjory followed me onto Timesharetalk and preceded to argue the Moderators did there job.
Fact 4 you say this site is just for general chat but people come on here to get information,if you believe you cannot give them correct advice than this site should refer them to other sites.
fred i have proved beyond any doubt that there is a anti timeshare slant on this site,you yourself as said your against Timeshare Jan as said the same thing,fullmonty/Marjory actually runs a villa rental scheme so is opposed to timeshare.
I was the only one trying to rectify this situation by giving factual answers.
Barry
Fact 1 fullmonty/Marjory whatever name they go under posted
unsubstantiated accusations on this site i challenged them.
fact 2 before i came onto this site i never heard or communicated with fullmonty/Marjory so were the argument started before you must show me the proof.
Fact 3 fullmonty/marjory followed me onto Timesharetalk and preceded to argue the Moderators did there job.
Fact 4 you say this site is just for general chat but people come on here to get information,if you believe you cannot give them correct advice than this site should refer them to other sites.
fred i have proved beyond any doubt that there is a anti timeshare slant on this site,you yourself as said your against Timeshare Jan as said the same thing,fullmonty/Marjory actually runs a villa rental scheme so is opposed to timeshare.
I was the only one trying to rectify this situation by giving factual answers.
Barry
-
bazrat - Posts: 0
- Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 21:47 pm
by bazrat on Thu May 08, 2008 03:30 am
Ok Fred i have just did a search of this site i first posted about Dri on 15/12/2007 i than replied to a post which fullmonty did on 27/2/2008,so please Fred explain fully to me your statement with the proof that you have and please tell which other site we argued on for a protracted period.
"I do note however that the posters who were arguing here had previously had the same thing going elsewhere. One of them was warned off so the argument could not continue. At about that time the other started to post here, presumably in the fairly secure knowledge that the other would follow and the argument could begin again � which it did. On three threads. It seems therefore that the main purpose of coming here was more to continue the argument than to make fresh points as these had been gone over to the point of tedium elsewhere. Both clearly enjoy a good argument but it is quite clear that however well and accurately either made their point it would not influence the other one bit. The argument had therefore lost its point and, as it attracted very little input from others, was not contributing to this forum to the slightest degree".
Fred as a expert are you saying that Fullmontys statements were accurate.
I was asked not to recommend DRI to anybody on this thread which came as a complete surprise to me because i have posted on various sites my view on that matter.
I have noticed and proved that your allowed to use your vast experiences to advise people not to join because your crystal ball do's not work.
To set the record straight i have never been warned off any site apart from this one if you have proof that i have Fred please show it on here,or retract your statement.
please note this sorry state of affairs could have been nipped in the bud if you had asked fullmonty one basic question WHERE IS YOUR PROOF.
Barry
"I do note however that the posters who were arguing here had previously had the same thing going elsewhere. One of them was warned off so the argument could not continue. At about that time the other started to post here, presumably in the fairly secure knowledge that the other would follow and the argument could begin again � which it did. On three threads. It seems therefore that the main purpose of coming here was more to continue the argument than to make fresh points as these had been gone over to the point of tedium elsewhere. Both clearly enjoy a good argument but it is quite clear that however well and accurately either made their point it would not influence the other one bit. The argument had therefore lost its point and, as it attracted very little input from others, was not contributing to this forum to the slightest degree".
Fred as a expert are you saying that Fullmontys statements were accurate.
I was asked not to recommend DRI to anybody on this thread which came as a complete surprise to me because i have posted on various sites my view on that matter.
I have noticed and proved that your allowed to use your vast experiences to advise people not to join because your crystal ball do's not work.
To set the record straight i have never been warned off any site apart from this one if you have proof that i have Fred please show it on here,or retract your statement.
please note this sorry state of affairs could have been nipped in the bud if you had asked fullmonty one basic question WHERE IS YOUR PROOF.
Barry
-
bazrat - Posts: 0
- Joined: Sun Apr 20, 2008 21:47 pm
Return to Timeshare & Holiday Clubs
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests